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I'm so over dead French writers

On finding less existential literature.

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When I was researching my gothic novel, I read nothing but dead, existentialist French writers. I was obsessed with Jean-Valjean’s pursuit of redemption in a world that would only ever see him as a thief and Edmund Dantes’ quest for vengeance against those who proclaimed him a Bonapartist—these books are philosophically rich and literarily beautiful and I wanted nothing more than to write a book like that.

It’s because of the French Revolution. For a period of time, Paris was the epicenter of a new movement—a period of upheaval in which humanity raged against the monarchy that oppressed us. We even had the gumption to create our own form of government, our own form of religion. We reimagined society from scratch and that resulted in some really great literature.

Les Miserables, The Count of Monte Cristo—these are my favorite books of all time and they were born from that reinvention of society—from the idea that a person could be worth more. So too were Dangerous Liaisons and The Phantom of the Opera, and science fiction like Jules Verne’s Twenty Thousand Leagues Under the Sea and Around the World in Eighty Days. There was a literary sense of awakening—and French writers rose to the task. 

It was only the beginning. Drawn by the romantic notion of what 19th Century France did for Victor Hugo, Alexandre Dumas, and Honoré de Balzac, 20th century writers like Ernest Hemingway, Oscar Wilde, and F. Scott Fitzgerald flocked to Paris. This time it wasn’t political upheaval, but social upheaval that moved them. They wrote The Picture of Dorian Gray and The Great Gatsby, imagining personal freedoms through fiction while rekindling our romantic notions of what it meant to be an artist.  

For so long I read nothing but French literature—both the older French dead guys and the newer not-so-French dead guys. They were also my gateway into the English gothics—books like Dracula, A Christmas Carol, Frankenstein. To me, these classic works were the last novels to contain any sort of philosophical depth—to fill my life with literary beauty—and they were the tomes that inspired my novel Obscurity. 

But by the time my book was complete, I had thoroughly absorbed everything from that time and place I wanted to read and I entered a literary desert. I tried to like modern literature, but I didn’t. I read dozens of beach reads which were fun, but missing that philosophical depth. Bereft of the literature that had thus far sustained me, I felt literarily empty. Hollow. Uncreative. I needed something deeper. Something that changed the way I thought. Or at least made me believe beautiful things for an hour or two.

In an attempt to sate my literary hunger, I returned to what I knew, this time drawing from the French realists: Honoré de Balzac, Emile Zola, Stendahl, Guy de Maupassant. But as I started filling up my Kindle, I found myself unwilling to read a single page. Post French Revolution France and Europe may have created philosophically rich books, but I was suddenly very over the darkness that haunts them, and the “fight” that so thoroughly plagues them.

I think we needed that “fight” to overthrow oppression, to form new governments, to establish equal rights and personal freedoms—there are things to fight for still—but I think we’ve reached the end of what fighting will do for us. At some point, I believe humans need to evolve beyond “fighting every wrong” toward “working together to create something right.” From “there’s a plank in your eye” to “here’s where we see eye-to-eye.” Canceling someone over one word they said on the internet seems proof we’ve taken the fight too far.

I’m also very over existentialism. How long can we continue to pine for meaning—and let that pining ruin us—before we accept that there is none and live happily? (This is why I have not yet ventured into Virginia Woolf or Edgar Allen Poe, perhaps unfairly.) As it is, I’ve never been taken with besotted philosophers. Those who drink themselves into oblivion only to find a meaningless existence at the bottom of their glass… (Ahem, Hemingway.) I don’t find genius in that work. I find misery. I find an existentialism that was left unsated. Or rather that was never really meant to be cured. 

Anthony Bourdain is a modern example of this archetype. In his documentary, Roadrunner, we see the portrait of a troubled man painted in the light of genius. “The first time I shot up, I looked at myself in the mirror with a big grin,” he says of his past drug use. “My whole life was leading up to that point. In my mind, it was my first step toward being an artist.”

In conversation with the artist David Choe—who admits to eating, debt, gambling, and sex addictions—Bourdain asks: “Do you think a certain level of dissatisfaction or unhappiness is an integral part of the creative process?” 

“I think even great art can be created when you’re happy, but I think the best art in the universe is created through intense suffering,” Choe answers, while painting in a bathrobe. “So then, do you put yourself in a situation where you’re constantly in pain? And the answer to that question is yes.” 

“That’s just about everyone I know,” Bourdain responds.

I’m not one for the “suffering artist” trope. In fact, I vehemently oppose it. What do I, the patron of that art, take from someone who lives haunted by his shadow, yet stands unwilling to turn on the light? Who bemoans his meaningless existence time and time again yet does nothing to make his life more meaningful? How long can we glorify artists for their intentional pain? For toiling away at an art form that can only ever be regressive, and never seeks to be progressive? 

The French Revolution was a dark time, to be sure, but the artists that came out of it were decidedly not—it was the Enlightenment! These artists were the light seekers. The ones who found something worth striving for. The ones who dared to dream up something better. And I think a similar shift is happening now—that something about the pandemic altered the way we think and allowed us to reinvent the world ever so slightly. 

I want our literature to reflect that, I think it will. I think we are entering a new literary revival—the Renaissance after the Middle Ages—a period in which it is up to us artists to imagine, not what we need to get rid of or overthrow but what we want to create together. That we are on the precipice of a sort of literary idealism. Personally, my mind has sufficiently wandered from Paris and cigarettes and existentialism to happiness and humanism and utopia. That’s why I now find myself writing a utopian novel and searching for the literature that will inspire it. And that means swearing off the dusty old French writers that inspired my gothic novel and filling my bookshelves with the modern philosophers who will inspire my utopian novel. 

I’m not sure that can be found in dead philosophers. At first, I thought the opposite of existentialist French literature might be Buddhist Asian literature—that I might be able to find in Eastern thought what I couldn’t find in European thought. Though I am still exploring the Tao Te Ching, The Analects of Confucius, The Pillow Book, and Musashi and have found moments of great wisdom within these texts; I’ve also found a study of misogyny, racism, and military conquest. Even The Dalai Lama: An Extraordinary Life, though it depicts a great man of peace, also reveals also a man whose naïveté and pacifism became his country’s downfall. 

When Zen became western, we kept only the best parts of it—the personal peace part (as it turns out, one can more easily achieve personal peace when one has a military with which to defend that peace). We did the same with Stoicism. The philosophy was originally intended as a source of military fortitude—the stoic Epictetus once advised detachment from one’s family to avoid sadness in the case of their eventual demise—but was made more palatable for modern life by media execs like Ryan Holliday.

Even classic utopian texts have not stood the test of time. Though Thomas More’s Utopia was progressive for its time, the book imagines a meritocracy in which there is equal economic opportunity for all men, while women focused their energies on becoming better wives and mothers. Aldous Huxley’s Island fares better, but the inhabitants of Pala island are happy only because they have chosen to live cut off from the rest of the world, making them ripe for exploitation by the outside world.

Can our best source of wisdom really be the past? Must we dredge up the ideals of antiquity to the detriment of modern reason? Religion and politics do that enough for all of us, with rife enough effects on the world. Though the bible was once a living document, an ever expanding history of a people, the canon was closed in the third and fourth centuries forcing us to return to antiquity for spiritual wisdom. The constitution at least has amendments, but our justices still look to the past to define what our future should be. 

When the leaked draft from Justice Samuel Alito recalled Roe v. Wade, citing 13th century common law as the precedent, Saturday Night Live couldn’t help but imagine the exact moment in history that treatise was written. “We now go to that profound moment of moral clarity, almost a thousand years ago, which laid such a clear foundation for what our laws should be in 2022,” the skit teased. 

The point of history is to keep what works and quit what doesn’t—that’s progress. So I wonder if it makes sense to keep looking for wisdom in the past when we must throw half of it out before we find something worth keeping? And if that’s the case, who are the modern philosophers of today? What literature starts from where we are now and then keeps pontificating from there? What takes what we have already learned uses that to imagine something even better? 

Unfortunately, the nonfiction books that line bookstands and New York Times lists are rife with personal trauma, true crime, societal ills, and political outcry. Fiction is a nonstarter—I waded through dystopian after dystopian after AI apocalypse and found little I was willing to immerse myself in. Did you know there is a pandemic section of the book store? During the pandemic? Man do we love to pile it on!!!

Television is not exempt from this trend. In a matter of decades we went from 20-minute sitcoms to hour-long dramas. Erik Hoel documented entertainment’s decline into the dystopian in his recent essay “Why does culture get less happy year after year?” In the article he wonders why everything, even Star Trek, has become “dark and gritty,” over time. In the latest Star Trek: Picard, he says “characters are deeply unhappy and all of them suffer from some form of trauma.” 

It’s true, everything is dark and gritty now, and every character suffers some form of trauma. I’m reminded of another Saturday Night Live skit—this one a parody of the dark, DC movie The Joker. The digital short imagined what Sesame Street would be like if it too were made into a dark and gritty biopic: the origin story of Oscar the Grouch.

“Did we really need a dark take on Oscar The Grouch?” Variety asks in the fictional movie trailer. “No,” says The New York Times. 

I get why this happened. One look at a list of Pulitzer Prize winning books or Academy Award winning movies is all it takes to see what kind of books and films are taken seriously, but I don’t think we’re loving that as a society. There’s a reason why romance is the most popular fiction genre, why Hallmark Christmas movies see 72 million viewers each year, why Friends and Seinfeld continue to reign supreme as the most watched shows of all time, why Schitt’s Creek exploded during the pandemic—we’re looking for something happier. I’m looking for that too. And right now it seems like our only options are literary sad things or cheesy happy things.

I’m still looking for the unicorn. I want happy, beautiful, literary novels, from modern writers and thinkers. And I think they’re coming.

There are a few nonfiction books I’ve read and loved: How to Do Nothing, The Longing For Less, This Could Be Our Future, and perhaps my favorite, Wintering. Katherine May’s next book is called Enchantment so I’ll be very excited to read that one as well. I’ve written about my intense adoration for Steven Pinker’s book Enlightenment Now and I’m excited to read his other work too.

I’ve added several more to my reading list including Humankind: A Hopeful History and What We Owe The Future. In fiction, I’m currently reading The Ones We’re Meant to Find (WHAT A COVER!) and I’m excited to read Another Now next. I’m going to watch Star Trek and read Star Trek's Philosophy of Peace and Justice about the show’s adherence to a utopian universe. I made a TBR (to be read) list of all of these books (and others) through Bookshop if you’re interested in taking a peek:

Disney has picked up the thread—Moana, Frozen, and Up are inspiring (and gorgeously animated) stories. My husband and I are obsessed with the movie Soul—it is a visual masterpiece that somehow manages to tackle the whole “meaning of life” thing. Palm Springs is high up on my list too—a comedy that also masters philosophical complexity. Taka Waititi movies are similarly hopeful: Jojo Rabbit takes place in Nazi Germany, and yet it is one of the funniest, most beautiful movies I have ever seen. Similarly, his Hunt for the Wilderpeople about a foster youth who has lost everything exudes happiness and joy. 

I think Martijn Doolaard is the new (better) Henry David Thoreau. I think Marie Kondo is something of a modern Epicurus. I think Elon Musk is a modern Renaissance man—a Leonardo da Vinci or Benjamin Franklin. I think Barack Obama is a philosophical and political thinker, a Marcus Aurelius of our time. I think literary genius exists right now and I’m determined to find it. To follow it. To study it. To write it. To be part of the literary revolution. To write the beautiful, literary, happy, utopian novel I want to see in the world. 

I’m still looking for the next Victor Hugo though. So if you find that, do let me know. 

If you have any book recs, please leave them in the comments section! Comments are open to paid subscribers.

As always, thank you so much for being here.

Elle

P.S. I wasn’t done with this topic so I shared this post with Samuél Lopez-Barrantes of if not, Paris in advance, hoping he might be able to guide me toward modern literary genius. He wrote an incredible response that’s coming in a few days. Subscribe to his newsletter to get it—it will go live right here.

P.P.S. After he finished his essay, we still weren’t done with the topic. So we had a literary salon discussion about whether something written with all lowercase letters and emojis is the modern equivalent of Alexandre Dumas. We essayed back and forth until it got almost too long to publish and plan to continue the discussion in the comments. I’ll be sending that as our literary salon discussion on Friday and it will go live here.

P.P.S. As if it weren’t enough to hear from me, then Samuel, then both of us, all in one week—we still weren’t done talking. So I’m joining his literary salon discussion live this Sunday where we’ll talk it out on a Zoom call. That one’s for Samuél’s founding member subscribers + my Novelle Collector subscribers. If you are a collector and want to attend, email me for the link! ellegriffin@substack.com.

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Discourse 58

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Elle Griffin

I think that's why I love the movie Soul so much. It was the first time I've seen my "raison d'etre" defined so clearly. The main character spends the whole film trying to find her "spark" only to realize it's in the everyday moments. So I'm with you, joy isn't in the big grand gestures—it's a far more subtle thing.

I think that's true of novels too. I don't want to write the next Utopia—though it might be an ambitious city plan, it's entirely boring as a novel. I think there's room for subtlety here!

1 Aug 2022
Mark Starlin

This resonated with me so much. Our culture is saturated with darkness. From our news to our politics to our social media. It is hard to escape. Darkness prevades our entertainment also. Must every television character be "troubled?" Must every show have a social agenda? Must life be a constant battle? Must every thing be so bleak and dark and sad?

I don't want my entertainment to be "gritty realism." Isn't the real world tragic enough? Do we need to rehash it as entertainment. I don't find it very entertaining. I find it depressing.

Can't we have adventure, love, and happiness along with the gloom and doom (and zombies.) I want to be inspired and entertained by entertainment, not depressed and discouraged. I will freely admit it. I read (and watch movies) for escapism. I want to be transported to better places, to new worlds. To have adventure, and heroes (not anti-heroes), and happy endings.

We all experience tragedy. But tragedy and darkness shouldn't be the entirety of our outlook. We need hope also. A rare commodity these days.

I think that is why I rarely write entirely sad stories. I would rather be a small ray of light in the darkness. I would rather bring a smile with my writing. Despite some opinions, there is nothing wrong with happy endings.

Another thoughtful newsletter. Thanks, Elle.

2 Aug 2022
Elle Griffin

I so agree. And your writing IS a ray of happiness!!!!! That’s why I love it so much!!!!

3 Aug 2022
Mark Starlin

Thanks, Elle! 🤓❤️

3 Aug 2022
Samuél Lopez-Barrantes

Yes yes yes. Looking forward to our upcoming chat. But some beautiful and hopeful books that don’t shy away from the existentialist quandary:

-Jitterbug Perfume by Tom Robbins
-The Overstory by Richard Powers
-Farewell Cowboy by Olja Savicevic
-Everything Kurt Vonnegut ever wrote
-The White Album by Joan Didion

2 Aug 2022
Elle Griffin

Thank you!

3 Aug 2022
Terrell Johnson

There's so much that's so great in this essay, Elle. Just, wow. It's like you and Erik Hoel have been reading my mind. So, so much to chew on.

This paragraph, especially, was so spot on:

'I think we needed that “fight” to overthrow oppression, to form new governments, to establish equal rights and personal freedoms—there are things to fight for still—but I think we’ve reached the end of what fighting will do for us. At some point, I believe humans need to evolve beyond “fighting every wrong” toward “working together to create something right.” From “there’s a plank in your eye” to “here’s where we see eye-to-eye.” Canceling someone over one word they said on the internet seems proof we’ve taken the fight too far.'

I have been VERY much feeling this lately. I used to love talking about, thinking about and discussing issues and politics and current events, but I must confess I find a lot of it exhausting now. Not the issues themselves, but the way we discuss them -- the same song-and-dance gets played out every time, among the same players, to the same tune. I'm with you! We need new ways forward. (And, that's exactly where I want to go -- the future, and not to endlessly replay the past.)

1 Aug 2022
Elle Griffin

I know! The things we have left to fight about, aren't fight worthy. We aren't "building countries" any more, we are "perfecting countries." And trying to do that with two sides (or parties) is just keeping it a battlefield. We need a different skillset now, we need to get on one side, and work toward common goals! ☺️

1 Aug 2022
Takim Williams

I think that some artists come around to this perspective over the course of their careers, perhaps because darkness and pessimism get old (if that's where the arist began, perhaps because they once though "serious" art required it), and keeping one's practice fresh requires injecting hope.

I can trace this progression in two of my favorite authors, George Saunders and Ted Chiang. (Saunders' early work is particularly bleak so maybe the bar is low lol). I plan to break this down on my Substack at some point, but for now I wonder what people think of "Exhalation" and "Ghoul." These stories are pretty dark in that the characters have their worlds turned upside down in existentially devastating ways... But they end with an uptick of hope that I think makes all the difference. (Exhalation in particular speaks to the Existentialist dilemma, I think)

lightspeedmagazine.com › exhalation
newyorker.com › ghoul

20 Oct 2024
Elle Griffin

+1 for Ted Chiang as one of the mold breakers! I haven't read a lot of Saunders, but appreciate having a specific rec! I'll take a read.

20 Oct 2024
Takim Williams

Agree with the sentiment here. I think some of what made Station Eleven popular (for example) was a general desire for something more hopeful. That's a post apocalyptic novel that leaves you feeling good when you're finished, and the HBO adaptation is absolutely beautiful.

20 Oct 2024
Elle Griffin

I've been meaning to watch that so thank you for the reminder!

20 Oct 2024
Jack Massa

Yes, to echo Mary Louisa, Hopepunk -- and also Solarpunk.
Also, I just read a book called Progress - Ten Reasons to Look Forward to the Future (2016) by Johan Norberg. It convinced me that, however bleak the present might appear, it is way better for a whole lot more people than any period in the past. So there's that.

1 Aug 2022
Elle Griffin

Amazing! I just added it to my book list. Thank you so much for the rec!

1 Aug 2022
Caroline Donahue

Books that have felt like utopian breakthroughs to me:
Tom Hodgkinson’s How to Be Idle
Lorin Roche’s Radiance Sutras
TJ Klune’s House in the Cerulean Sea
Jenny Offil’s Weather
Elizabeth von Arnim’s Enchanted April (love the film, too)
Groundhog Day the film

This is definitely an idiosyncratic list and isn’t necessarily all literary fiction, and not all fiction at all. But reading these, I felt hopeful we could do better. These were spread over the last decades, but they stuck with me, FWIW

1 Aug 2022
Elle Griffin

These are amazing, thank you so much! I just googled every one and added them to my list!
(Also I JUST watched Groundhog Day last week, such a classic!)

1 Aug 2022
Caroline Donahue

I'm so happy they look helpful to you. I am a compulsive book recommender, so beware once you get me started. :-)

2 Aug 2022
Elle Griffin

You’re always welcome here. I’m a compulsive “throw the book out if I’m not into the first three chapters-er” so I could use all the recs I could get!

3 Aug 2022
Caroline Donahue

I support this strategy!

8 Aug 2022
A
Alice S. Hudson

Dear Elle,

Thank you so much for an article that resonates with me 1000%. I feel that we badly need advance scouts leading us out of the intellectual/literary killing fields of the last 100 years. (Could two of the most traumatic events in world history WWs1&2 have anything to do with that long Dark Age?)

I wonder do you know Henri Bergson, French philosopher born 1859, "known for his arguments that processes of immediate experience and intuition are more significant than abstract rationalism and science for understanding reality"? His thought brightened the philosophical terrain for so many. And Pierre Teilhard de Chardin whose brand of theological/philosophical positivism turned the lights up even higher. William James the American philosopher wrote in 1908 of Bergson: " So modest and unpretending a man but such a genius intellectually! I have the strongest suspicions that the tendency which he has brought to a focus, will end by prevailing, and that the present epoch will be a sort of turning point in the history of philosophy." And then there was Emerson and the Transcendentalist movement in the US. And Mary Baker Eddy who lit up all of Christendom with her new understanding of "matter" and the allness of God. All of this revelatory work done around the turn of the last century now seems almost invisible.

My simple theory is that the horrors of the world wars drove the development of philosophical and theological thought underground and prevented or delayed the Bergsonian tendency from prevailing.

Maybe the new tendril of happiness or well-being based StoryMind that we are starting to recognise and desire is part of a resurgence...or a re-emergence into a line of light.

28 Aug 2022
Elle Griffin

I hadn't heard of these folks, thanks for sharing them with me.

I think war served a purpose when it was against tyranny. But now I think we just need to work together to make the world even better. And I think we're in a good enough place to do it. At the very least, my art will head in that direction!

29 Aug 2022
Matthew Garcia

Oooof...this deeply resonates!

I too have a push/pull relationship with those post-Revolutionaries and their timeless, ever-longing ilk, both before and after the cout d' etat :). Sometimes I find myself saying to them, "You're stuck! Do something different! Go upstate, or do a cold plunge. What would Jen Sincero say if she saw this poor-woe-is-me wade pool of despair after you've earned your freedom!" But it's like a toxic relationship...we can't get enough. Until we have.

My thoughts are similar to yours with a slight twist; the ardor, attempted pragmatism, and beautiful lattice-work of word and structure - that anachronistic novelty that a pimply, prose-loving youth gravitates toward when the crush of lit first strikes - steeps us into a tethered relationship. In modern armchair therapist terms, maybe one would call it persisted trauma bonding from the honeymoon stage of a past love?

My TBR response thus far has been two fold, and seems to keep me measured in my own relationship with the classics, and ultimately myself:

1. While I'm not fully off the societal introspection-of-trauma-origin train, I've gravitated toward realism and it's many shades; particularly that of the post-WWII west, before we officially hit the star spangled neo-liberalism era of the 80's. This was a fascinating time where many of those that financially famined in the 15ish years prior, now feasted, or at least could finally make a reservation at their farm-to-table of choice...they just needed to order the Uber of determination and domain/community-minded progress. As it does, culture and literature followed it's reflective suit with society, but these fiction-adjacent philosophers seem different. There was a translucently veiled optimism coupled with their immense tragedy of the 20 years prior. Uncle Sam and his industrial military Capitalism complex was still surrounded by scaffolding, which meant artists, writers, bankers, laborers, hippies, and whoever else could live and discover what they were about in terms of fulfillment, while riding the America-leading-the-way net of supposed financial and idea freedom (democratic socialism is great when it's managed properly). I know that's an immensely loaded statement, but something about that period just hits different, and I can't get enough of it, in a positive fills-me-up kinda way. Instead of the scale being heavily tipped in favor of "where we came from", it was balanced with "where do I, and we, WANT to go?". I respect the hell out of them for this perspective, because it's difficult to consistently maintain. It requires reflection, but also a departure from self. It's easy to fall into the sad, existential doom loop, because you never have to leave, and the message resonates with everyone. That's why it sells. On repeat. But not everyone wants to put the next foot forward and walk in a new direction. That takes guts...and real growth.

2. In this vein, I'm also working to curate a list of classic/notable nostalgia-core to understand what literary elements and principles I can incorporate into my life, mindset, and writing, without being consumed. I think I'm loosely attempting to understand the timeless shapes and colors that uplift and inspire, without getting mired in the nostalgia-emotion muck that can saturate the genre. Kinda like using a map in NYC to navigate the grid, without actually locking in on an acute position.

For me, John Updike, Peter Taylor, Saul Bellow, and their many contemporaries hit the spot when I'm craving this perspective and ethos. If you're interested in detailed and objective truth-seeking that typically drives history lovers, this particular era of the genre (as well as magical realism) is also an immensely fun way to pick apart the zero to one truth and fiction of how the heck we got to our current state of societal, cultural and literary state of things.

As always, thank you, Elle!

28 Dec 2023
Elle Griffin

I can relate to the love of the old prose—and the need to curate it so we don't wind up in the doom loop! That's why I spent all last year reading utopian novels and it's why I'm reading humanist texts now! I've struggled to love modern literature as I find it adheres to that same doom loop, though agree that magical realism has been once way out of it. Have you read anything good in that vein I should read?

Thanks Matthew!

28 Dec 2023
Brennan Quenneville

I highly recommend Hank Green’s An Absolutely Remarkable Thing and its sequel, A Beautifully Foolish Endeavor. They’re pretty much exactly what you seem to be looking for: well-written, deep explorations of being alive right now, with an eye to what’s next. There’s a strong focus on being Very Online that feels relevant for a Substack writer.

3 Aug 2022
Nishant Jain

This was a nice read, Elle. Have you read Kurt Vonnegut?

2 Aug 2022
Samuél Lopez-Barrantes

+1 for Kurt

2 Aug 2022
Elle Griffin

No! Checking out....

3 Aug 2022
Nishant Jain

In case you need an endorsement, I came to his writing after the classics, because we got access to european authors before american in india. And everything he has written completely and forever changed my idea of what writing could be about. I would suggest Cats cradle, or Sirens of Titan as a relevant start for you.

3 Aug 2022
Elle Griffin

Ok that’s helpful. I was just looking at all the titles wondering where I should start....

3 Aug 2022
Samuél Lopez-Barrantes

I think "Galapagos" is one of his most underrated. Slaughterhouse-5 is quite strange, as is Cat's Cradle ... not necessarily a bad thing, but just worth mentioning. As an appetizer to his work, this is one of my favorite videos on the Internet:

youtube.com › watch

4 Aug 2022
Michael Estrin

Good post, Elle! I had no idea there was a pandemic section in the bookstore these days, or maybe I just blocked it out. But yeah, we do pile on indeed. I wish had some suggestions for happy literary novels to give you, but I agree, it's pretty bleak out there these days.

I really enjoyed Humankind, so I was glad to see it on your list. I've always thought people were basically good, so it was fascinating to read a book about how we engineer society with the exact opposite premise. Also, I felt seen by his take on Lord of the Flies. Never a fan of that novel.

1 Aug 2022
Elle Griffin

Oh awesome, glad I’ve got that one on the list! I guess we’ll have to keep looking for the rest... 🤓

2 Aug 2022
G. M. (Mark) Baker

There is an awful lot to digest and reflect on here, and I am already a couple of thousand words into writing a response which will appear in my newsletter once I have a chance to finish it. But for now, a book recommendation that may seem to come out of left field. It is not strictly a novel, but a kind of parody of self help books written by a novelist. It is Walker Percy's _Lost In the Cosmos_. It is a strange concoction, but brilliant, and I think it bears very much on the questions you are asking here. I'd be interested to know what you make of it.

1 Aug 2022
Elle Griffin

This looks hilarious. Definitely adding it to the list.

Thanks Mark! And looking forward to reading your post!

1 Aug 2022
G. M. (Mark) Baker

And here is my post, "Being is meaning enough. Love is purpose enough": storiesallthewaydown.com › being is meaning enough love is purpose

4 Aug 2022
Elle Griffin

This was amazing. So grateful for this discourse. Continued it in your comments!

4 Aug 2022
M. Louisa Locke

I think you might take a look into the subgenera of speculative fiction called hope punk. en.wikipedia.org › Hopepunk
Then I would look at this series of posts on hope punk by Susan K Quinn susankayequinn.com › hopepunk musings see if anything inspires you. Certainly felt like she was coming from a similar place to where you are at in this point of time.

Good luck on your journey.

1 Aug 2022
Elle Griffin

Thank you so much Mary! I hadn't heard of hope punk!

1 Aug 2022
Mike

Darkness is easy. Light is hard. Inspired light is very hard.
I'm blown away by your reading list and have to think about it
more. I find solace in reading Gary Snyder, but like all humans
he has his problems. Folks like Hemingway drive me nuts with
their "poseurness." Thanks for a amazing post.

1 Aug 2022
Elle Griffin

Thank you, Mike!

1 Aug 2022
Patrick E McLean

"I’m also very over existentialism. How long can we continue to pine for meaning—and let that pining ruin us—before we accept that there is none and live happily? "

I think you've stepped in the great struggle. If there is no meaning, around what does a group of people cohere? On what foundation morality? I agree that fighting is a terrible metaphor for the struggle to make things better, but you've got to have a definition of "better" to struggle for.

Without meaning, why would you plant trees the shade of which you will never get to sit under? Why don't we build Cathedrals? (by that I mean massive, beautiful things for their own sake)

I don't presume to have the answer. But I think part of it is found in Christopher Booker's "Seven Basic Plots: Why We Tell Stories" The title is fairly trivial for what is a monster of a book in both size and erudition.

I think what you are looking for can be found, often, in children's books. The Robot and the Bluebird by David Lucas is an amazing allegory.

I also think a Wizard of Earthsea by Ursula K. LeGuin is incredibly uplifting.

As far as I can tell, modern literary fiction seems to be bent on self-destruction.

1 Aug 2022
Elle Griffin

That's the point of existentialism: If there is no meaning to life, then it's up to us to make it meaningful! 🥰

And I'm with you, children's books are the winners here (Narnia! Neverland! Wonderland!!! Does it get any better???)

Ok actually now that I think about it, wonderland might actually be dystopian... 😆

1 Aug 2022
Patrick E McLean

The upshot of the point of existentialism is that we can't seem to do that on our own. It's too much to ask of an individual. And it seems like it has to be mediated by stories or tradition. Which leaves us in the pickle -- if you want to write great uplifting stories, you have to have other great uplifting stories to draw from.

I think you have to start with meaning to life if you want strong emotional effect. I don't think you can start with the idea that all narratives are equally true.

Which I think, is why most of modern literary fiction seems so broken to me.

2 Aug 2022
Elle Griffin

Of course we can create meaning on our own! I live a very meaningful life. A lot of people do! And I don’t think we need ancient stories to have that.

That being said, I hope my utopian novel will fill that void and be a meaningful story other artists can draw from. 🤓

3 Aug 2022
Patrick E McLean

I LOVE your optimism! (And this substack, btw) But I’m very skeptical about your claim. I would like to hear an example of something meaningful that you have created in your life that doesn’t come from an ancient story, one way or another. I think you are more deeply embedded in culture than your statement suggests. At best, we remix meaning.

I think you will find that, for your Utopian novel, you will use the same symbols and the same tropes as everyone else does — maybe better, maybe worse — but that culture is all we have to work with. Mostly this is rehashing Christianity. Or pieces of it at least.

An example,

In the original Norse mythology there is no test of worthiness for Thor. He wields the hammer because he is strong. In the same way that Beowulf nor Achillies have no kind of moral component.

But as the story of Thor is updated and transformed, the very Christian idea of worthiness is added to it. And he becomes a different kind of hero.

I don’t know if this makes sense, but you want to do a podcast about it?

3 Aug 2022
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